Been thinking for awhile now about getting a pair of haflingers. I noticed a team coming up in an amish auction. If you have some time behind some I'd be curious to know your opinions on them. Just saw the picture Jay posted on another thread and am very curious to know how happy you are with them. Just would use them to do chore work feeding big round bales, dragging firewood, hauling manure, etc...

I have a team 7 and 9 years. I really enjoy them. They have lots of stamina for a small horse. Went on a wagon drive then after drove home the 12 miles after. I mainly use them for pulling a wagon but did rake hay last summer for a field day. All depends on the individual horses of course. They are easy keepers!

Broke 3 of them for others. Only one would I want to own. Miserable beasts in my opinion. Pony attitude in a baby belgain body. And I like ponies!

This is a classic question similar to, which is best? Ford, Chevy or Dodge? John Deere vs Case IH, etc. There are good and bad in all breeds, dogs, cats, horses and humans. Can you go over before the sale and ask to see them caught, hitched and drive them?
To many variables to be able to tell you to buy them and you will be happy ever after.

Ryan, I LOVE my haflingers. They work very hard when I ask them and they are extremely easy to keep. My children handle them regularly and are not intimidated by their size. They are easy to harness and hitch, my eldest could harness, hitch, work, unhitch, and unharness all on his own when he was only 13.

I believe I can keep four for about the same cost as a big team. It gives me more versatility when doing jobs around the farm. If I need more horsepower, just add more horses. But when I don't, I can split up the teams and put my son to work with one while I use the other. I currently own seven haflingers, six mares and a stallion. Five are broke to work or ride (kids' favorite activity), the other two hopefully will be as well after this summer. Since my stallion turns three this year, I was able to get his license from the American Haflinger Registry and I am hoping for a nice foal crop next year.

Jobs I have done with my Haflingers: commercial carriage rides, commercial sleigh rides, taking produce to market in the wagon, primary tillage, secondary tillage, cultivating, irrigation, skidding logs, plowing snow/moving dirt with a back blade, dragging a York rake, moving a chicken tractor, cleaning the barn with a dirt scoop, mowing hay, tedding hay, raking hay, and spreading manure.

Jobs I plan on doing: bale hay, use All Crop 60 to harvest grain, plant grain with a drill, pull a single row corn harvester, and use a sweep/treadmill to perform numerous tasks.

Sorry for the long winded response, but you asked. I am not an expert and have learned from many mistakes, but I am passionate about working with my Haflingers. These horses are a wonderful addition to our family and are instrumental in helping us progress towards our goal of a fossil fuel free farm.

I think they are like any other horse- there are gooduns' and baduns' and 90% of the horse is in the guy driving them. I love my Haffies. They aren't perfect, but no horse is.

I have only had one. Particularly bought to breed mules with the mare was a little too flighty for my taste sand the mules turned out the same way. A one of ,is a pretty poor sampling for sure, but talking to others who have owned them, I found most thought before they bought then that they had the temperament of a heavy horse like belgiums or percherons, and then found out they didn't.
Years ago when they were a true pony ,they appeared to be the right answer for small farms, but like any breed of any animal ,what happened in the past ,happened to haflingers. Man stepped in and decided they wanted then taller. Now it is really hard to find the heavy drafty type haflinger in the 13 hh size of true pony. I don't consider 14hh pony size. Hopefully Klaus wills chime in, he seems to know a lot about their past history. Personally I would opt for a smaller team of good mules that would keep easier ( not eat as much) and two 13 HH mules would out work two 13 HH haflingers. JMHO

I have dealt with Haflingers for years there like other horses and mules good and bad. Have had unbroke and broke ones ride and drive, ones you could trust and the rest of them.

In other posts that Vince refers to obviously I mentioned that in addition to our big drafts we use a Haflinger for farm work. Haflingers in general used to be very dependable and calm horses. And that was logical because where they were used originally , on the steep mountainsides of the Austrian and Bavarian Alps farmers had no use for high-strung horses. But then during the sixties when horses all but disappeared on farms in the two regions people had the idea to cross-breed them with Arabians and the Arabo-Haflinger was born in an attempt to make them more like small riding horses and therefore more marketable. After a few generations these efforts at cross-breeding were stopped but of course, the so-called refined Haflinger from then on dominated the bloodlines. In recent videos from last year's Horse Progress Days one sees exclusively these kinds of Haflingers since apparently American importers and consequently breeders preferred that kind of horse. The modern Haflinger undeniably is more high-strung than his ancestors, but of course you will always find individual differences. I may point out that a similar development took place among the heavy breeds in this country and that among Belgians, Percherons, Clydesdales etc you will also find great individual differences in disposition and character.
Since Haflingers have a lot of stamina and for their size great strength they can do a lot of work. I should mention that it was not unusual that "in the old days" on those afore-mentioned mountain farms Haflingers would be kept in the stable during the harsh winters with lots of snow for weeks and then still could be put to use on good days without any great risks of misbehaving. My Haflinger may sometimes not work for three or four weeks and then be okay , but he is a) of the old-fashioned deep-bodied roundish type and b) seventeen years old. They get better as they get older.

I love KM's response, because mine would be the same! They do tend to be a little hot, and when you really ask them to get down and do something, you run out of horse.

Perhaps people who think Haflingers are too "hot" need to take a more knowledgeable person with them when they go to pick out horses to buy. I have had several Haflingers and not one of them was too "hot" to be good useable draft animals. People who don't know what they're doing or who buy the first thing to come along are the ones that get stung and have bad experiences. One of the Haflingers that I owned was by far the best horse I ever saw at following a mark. His ability to be at the right place was something to behold. I have been around a lot of horses and I have never seen one as natural as he was. Don't be taken in by the team just because they are being offered at an Amish auction. I have seen very few Amish who were really horsemen; they merely used them. In fact, I would just as soon some rattle snake got hold of one of my horses as to have some Amish touch them.

I've had a team of Haflinger mares for about 8 years. I bought them as a team and they were 4 & 5 years old at the time. Both are the "old fashion" tank built type. Both mares do anything I ask...but the younger one has a little more dance to her! I have a 7 year old mare mule off the calmer one and she is JUST like her mom...NOTHING rattles her!! Everything is just another task to conquer, with her and she has the sweetest personality on our farm! She leaves the herd when she sees me in the yard...ready for whatever I want to do!! I love mine!!

I've had Belgians, Percherons, a Clydesdale, Mules from every mix and nothing has been as easy to break from beginning or as enjoyable finished as the Haflingers I've worked. Mine or other peoples. They do better if you train them with a mule in mind.

I use 3 and they seem fine to me. I agree they do run out of power a littler if you are using just 2. I also agree they are a bit pony headed but find the more you use them the more manners they have. I may be more inclined to call them a bunch of “stinkers” before calling them “gentlemen” but their spiritedness I am sure adds to their toughness. They will stand to open a gate or hitch a log. I work alone so they need to be able to stand well enough for me to work safely, however they are not the type of horse that one would use picking corn. Ryan if you are just planning on hauling a wagon and working in the woods I think you will be pleased with their work ethic, if you are planning on doing a lot of plowing or mowing you may be disappointed with how long they are able to work. My advice is to stay away from anything less than 14.2hh and is not heavy boned
The horse on the right is a 15hh heavy boned horse, the one on the right is 14.2hh and lighter boned.

Billy,

I thought I had the patent on the "redneck hitch rail". I am referring to the rings in the end of the barn to tie to.

Apparently great minds think alike.

Todd

Carl Byerly,I didn't see anyone saying the haflingers are "TOO HOT". What I and others have posted is that they are not the calm disposition pony that some folks think they are when first looking at them for a draft pony and certainly do not mimic heavy horses used in draft work.

I am sure Klaus and KM have been around horses and teams for many years and I have about 40 years under my belt, so I think the people who responded to this question are not neophytes that don't know horses.

I think, JMHO,that 14-2 to 15 hd haflingers are out of the pony size draft size that the haflinger is known for.

This is the 13 hd mule mama I had that was too flighty for my tastes and the mules I bred with her were about the same temperament wise. As one can see she was the older, short, heavy boned, type. Those mules finished out to 15 hds and I had them 10 and 12 years before I gave up on them and replaced with something more sedate.

As I am sure everyone could see I had a typo, the hose on the Left is fine boned, on the right is heavy boned. Sorry about that.

Billy, those are good looking horses. Thanks for the pic that really helps. Do you think 4 abreast Haflingers could do more than a big team, assuming all were in good shape? They just seem much easier to work with when it comes to harnessing and trailering.

I have broke out 4 sets of ponies for my own and sold all but one set. Broke out a team of haflingers and a single. They were tough enough but not as tough as my welsh pony and welsh crosses. The acted a little like ponies and mules in that you had to make it their idea to do what you wanted. They would also sulk if they felt you were over working them. I hooked them with my 13.2 750 lb welsh cross mare to start. She gave us 300 lbs if an ounce to the haffies. She worked them into the ground. I hooked with one then the other and she still had more gas. I have yet to see a haffie I would own. They must be out there but I have yet to find one. I will say haflingers and belgains are the only breeds I have yet to find one of that I wouldn't own. Been around some great perchrons, clydes, shires, welsh cob, welsh pony, morgans, QH, arabs, walkers, foxtrotters, friesians and crosses of the above. You name it I have found some that I would take home. Yet to find a haflinger that I you could pay me to take. I was enamored with the size and thought I wanted to have some. Broke the 3rd one and figured it was time to bail on that bad idea.

Ryan I only have experience using 3 and I would say that 3 haflingers can work as long, and as hard as most full sized teams.

Agreeing with most of what folks are saying here, and adding my .02...They're attitudes always seem to be good when they have jobs to do, often. Just enough grain to get used up by the task and the ones I had would usually stay calm and focused on the job at hand. I had one that turned into a bully with other horses and kids after I gave him away 'cuz of too much food and not enough work.

Specifically, folks talking about the shorter, heavier-boned ones come from the "M" line (which is what I've had) with even shorter ones coming from the "W" line with names that start with that letter i.e. Murl, Midas, Winston, etc. The taller, leggier ones tend to be in the "ST" line and you see names like Star, Style, etc. My understanding is that there were originally 7 lines: A, B, M, N, S, ST and W, going back to the original 7 stallions. Quite an interesting history they have.

As size comparison, I've heard folks say they like the Fjords a little better because of their calmer disposition.

Good luck and keep us posted.

In judging horses one has to understand what they are supposed to be doing. In Haflingers that has changed a lot. From the original 13.5 hh calm agricultural draft and pack animal to the modern version of a 14 hh versatile lighter riding and carriage horse was a big step. Breeding that kind of horse changed the disposition in many, but not all of the Haflingers. Austrian and Bavarian breeders reject the idea that what they are breeding is a pony, they are breeding a horse. What is " too hot" for one user of the horse maybe just the right agile temperament for the other. That is why before you purchase a horse you have to ask yourself which kind of horse you can handle. If you are confident that you can handle different kinds of horses, you can buy one at an auction where you NEVER can be really sure what you will be getting because there is too little time and opportunity to check out the horse. Buy a horse from reputable breeders, traders and users who give you an opportunity to thoroughly observe and even try out the horse and who may even give you a scope of what they can guarantee and what they cannot. It never ceases to amaze me how many people buy horses at the spur of the moment, most wouldn't buy a car like that, even though handling a car is much easier than handling a horse.
Again, if you need horses for agricultural work, the modern type of Haflinger is probably not the right kind of horse in most cases because in proportion to its height it weighs too little. Any horse that is asked to do work that its conformation doesn't really make it fit for, is likely to become " hotter" because it has to overcome the lack of weight=pulling power with exerted strength. The same holds true for big horses. Using bigger hitches may help a little bit, but does not really address the disposition problem for the individual horse.

Vince Mautino, I don't recall pointing my finger at anyone on this forum. I was merely relating what I have observed over many years and what I said still stands. What's the use in having a forum for ideas and experiences if those things can't be shared without someone jumping to conclusions that someone in particular is being targeted. If I ever decide to target anyone in particular, you'll know it.

Klaus, the description on conformation you give is why the hitchy horses of all draft breeds don't work out good in the woods.

Exactly right, Bill. When you have a horse of over 17 hh, and you cannot measure at least 4 hands between the forelegs at the chest then you know that your horse is not well proportioned for a good draft. There will be exceptions, like always, and horses that do not conform to that standard still will pull well without too much mettle, but that is a rule of thumb that I have observed in a lifetime of love of heavy horses. Most modern types look different because in order to gain speed one had to breed horses with the legs being more underneath the chest than at the corners( same holds true for Haflingers). Some may even have great depth of chest, but the width is lacking. Also, the obsession with high knee action in hitch horses ((which by the way is not instrumental for greater speed - a contradiction to the aforementioned goal -because it shortens the length of stride) has led to body conformation among draft horses that make them look more like big carriage horses than real drafts. I guess the real draft lovers have to go the way that the late Dick Brown went, who bred the father of one of my Percheron geldings, and start preferring for breeding material a different kind of horse. In Haflingers we will probably also have to go a way of greater divergence because the modern ones are definitely not on the draft side.
Carl, let me assure you, I did not feel that you were attacking anyone except that you may have generalized the Amish a bit too much. I do agree that people when buying horses should try to get help from those of us who have been around a while, but I am afraid we are waning fast in numbers.

Carl. Your initial statement "Perhaps people who think Haflingers are too "hot" need to take a more knowledgeable person with them when they go to pick out horses to buy" to me inferred finger pointing since only I, KM, and Klaus posted negative comments about Haflingers which were not really negative , but only described what has been experienced in their temperament. I don't think that is jumping to conclusions.

Perhaps your post should have read, the haflingers I have suit me very well because.........

This forum is well noted for diversity of opinions , but stated in a courteous way. Sorry if I touched a raw nerve.

If you use them every day and feed them according most all horses and mules will settle or slow down in 2-4 weeks of use. I have broke to ride race horses just fresh off of the track In 2 weeks most were calm enough they walked out of the corral with the rest of the horses But we rode at least 20 miles to work and back home plus roped yearlings and doctored them for foot rot and pinkeye all day. We only had 1400 head to look at each day. the first week the race horses pranced sideways all the way over and back. the more you use them the better they get you trained to there ways

KC you have basically said what my grandfather said. He would be 95 if he were still with us. He grew up farming and ranching with horses. He wanted his horses a little "hot" as they were generally tougher and lasted longer. Wasn't afraid of the hot ones. He continued to have a team to the day he died. And most the time kept a Shire stallion and bred a few mares. He said as the work for a draft horse started to dry up he had to turn down his breeding. People didn't want or need all day teams they wanted 3 hour teams. He bred for quiet calm horses. That is the difference that time and work makes. Now very few of us have 365 days of work for horses. Myself we use them daily about 2 hours from November into May. Then intermittently the remainder of the year. There are guys here that have the work to make most critters into a fair horse. But most need the disposition that has them wanting to be broke.

the horse,mule or dog that you can use 1-3 days a week or month Has always been hard to find. The hot or spoiled ones take A lot more work than most people have for them. The spoiled ones are smart that is why they are spoiled. I love animal's that can and will go all day.

Just curious where you live. I have a nice pair of Draft type mares that are good as gold for anything. Because of health problems, I would like to find a good home for them in S.E. Michigan. Have harness and wagon. They also come with a .donkey. Serious people only because this is heart breaking for me.

I live in North central Nebraska of south Ainsworth, north of broken bow. I understand your feelings and Hope that you find someone to take and use your mares. The best to you and yours.